[WF-General] Distinguishing Admin and Player

Pug pug007 at sgi.net
Mon Oct 9 17:04:34 PDT 2000

On Mon, Oct 09, 2000 at 11:25:33AM +0100, Alistair Riddoch wrote:
> > Vigilantes, who take on task of "cleaning out" cheaters
> Such a role could be effectively fulfilled without breaking the game
> paradigm. Such a Player could have a character who is an officer in the
> town guard who could arrest cheaters, and lock them up in the town jail. (*)

[For all the following, Belchfire is assumed]

I disagree here. This is a bad trap to get into for two reasons. First off, 
you're punishing people for exploiting bugs instead of fixing them. UO really
fell into this. If players are able to cheat in your game, the proper thing
to do is FIX it. Punishing people and leaving the hole open will not stop them
all, and will only cause strife. Now, if a player finds a *new* bug, it's a
bit different. If they report it, they should be in some way rewarded, even if
it's just a hearty pat on the back. OTOH, if they are exploiting it, actions
should be taken, I think, from the ADMINS/GMs, which brings up to the next

In-character and out-of-character should remain separated. This is important
to the entire game. This means that characters arresting cheaters is Bad, and
hurts the RPing and overall theme of the game.

> * This relates to an idea I have been thinking of for a while. SOme of you may
> have read a rant I wrote a while ago about consequences in Online games.
> Sociable character behavoir can be encouraged by implementing consequences
> for anti-social behavoir such as blatant stealing, or murder. Having
> the character spend a while imprisoned would be a good consequence, and I
> think an effective one.

I'm forced to disagree again. We had discussions on this a while back, so
check out some of the Archives, especially about my Prime Justice System (I
really need to finish that Devguide I have on the site, maybe I can get to
it this week). Quite simply, trying to punish antisocial behavior by a
hard-coded engine will not work. UO tried this, too, and it got very ugly.
The best approach to take is to simply give players the ability and
responsibility to deal with these things. If someone's out killing people,
then get a lynch mob or something together. Also note that people going on
killing sprees for the hell of it is definately reduced in a world where
death really hurts.

> > One who composes background music for his guild and for others
> I think it is essential that this kind of creativity is possible purely from
> a player point of view. The player in question should be strongly encouraged
> to have a musician character who is the channel for this creativity into the
> game world.

Sounds good to me.

> > Developer who helps create quests, and has 5 char's in game
> Here the line becomes fuzzy. As I explained in an earlier mail (which may have
> got lost), I believe it should be possible to create quests using a Player
> account to a large extent. This could for example be done, by logging in
> as a Player account which owns some important "evil" NPCs. This player could
> then direct the actions of some of these NPCs in order to move them into
> the situation required for the quest to run. From a certain point of view
> this person may seem to be an Admin, but the account they are using has no
> special Admin privs, it just is the account that owns the relevant NPCs.
> Some aspects of quests are going to need Admin access. An example of
> this would be if a quest involved hunting for an ancient artifact that
> has been hidden in some caves for centuries, then the object must be
> placed there out-of-game.

We've discussed this a bit, too, and quests can definately be run by both
players and GMs. Now, although players can certainly do a lot, we expect to
need to have some "kick-starts" in the game world, especially early on, when
all the Nations are stilled ruled by NPCs, and the playerbase is low. For
this, we've planned on having both GMs running quests, long-term and short, and
also special "Quest" people who's only extra ability is being able to possess
most NPCs.

"Life, death, genocide, that's all small beans. All the important battles are
fought upon the fields of Nomenclature."	http://egrep.org

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