[WF-Infra] New website?

kosh at aesaeion.com kosh at aesaeion.com
Sat Jun 2 15:15:12 PDT 2001

On Tue, 29 May 2001, Philippe Jadin wrote:

> > If you would log onto irc and join #infra we can talk about exactly
> > is going on with the new site design. Currently it is on
> irc is not really an option now, because I'm still on pricey dialup...
> > http://moria.mit.edu:8080/wf The site structure is slightly delayed right
> > now while I wait for the python imaging library to be installed I will
> > email the admins of moria again tonight if it is not installed by then.
> Let me tell you that it seems really good work!
> > Yeah help is always appreciated a good way to start would be learning how
> > CompoundDoc works. http://www.zope.org/Members/kosh/CompoundDoc is where a
> I'll still need some training to understand this ! Does it work on latest
> zope 2.3.2? I installed it here but I get strange behaviors. Maybe I don't
> understand it well yet. Another point is the fact that ftp access seems
> impossible.
It works on zope 2.3.2 and requires the python imaging library. FTP to it
currently is impossible and probably never will be possible. FTP is
designed for flat files and as such is really imcompatible with a doc of
this kind. Example let say you hae a document that has a textarea, a title
area, a file, an image, and sql db query etc when you ftp to it which
should it try and update? How should it to the updating? etc.

There are currently some working on the zope fat client project which is a
project to make a wxPyton interface to using using xml-rpc. CompoundDoc
will be able to work over that so while it will probably never have an ftp
or webdav interface it will get soap and xml-rpc.

> > Content can currently be done in dtml, stx, and html. stx can optionally
> > be turned off on a per item basis inside the CompoundDoc.
> Seems to be what is needed. Anyway, I though of a simplier solution : have a
> dtml doc with a "type" property and when included in the template, it is
> converted to stx if type=stx for example. but your solution seems a lot more
> complete and usefull.
The problem is dtml documents are not catalog aware. They have to be
manually indexed for searching which is 1 a pain. 2 a serious drain on the
server. CompoundDocs will be able to index themselves incrementally when
changes are made. This keeps the searching always updated and it spreads
the load of updating the search index out pretty equally. It just becomes
part of the edit process.

> > The current structure is one of the things that was essentially tossed.
> > Too many things needed to be changed to make it truly work. The older
> > structure was really showing its age.
> The new structure seems very friendly. There is maybe too much things
> "hidden"
> in the dev section?
Actually it is not things are hidden in dev is it that things are not in
the area above it. The dev menu is the complete menu however it was judged
not to be newbie friendly so a friendlier menu was made for the main page.
Later on there will be an ability for logged in people to choose which
they want or customize it eventually.

> > The current way it is being done is both much simpler and much more
> > complex. You would have to see CompoundDoc to see why that is true.
> I begin to understand ;-). Do you think it will be possible to update with
> ftp?
Nope see reasons above.

> > The problem is that areas are too different for there to be one master
> > template. That is what has caused issues in many parts. The current object
> > being used can have many input and output templates so a swiss army knife
> > type tool can be used.
> Templates could be created per section or per page, with acquisition it
> should be possible.
The problem is that you don't need one template per section some sections
need many. Example worlds will need templates for cities, countries,
famous people, places, governement, religion etc and they will all be
a little different. However all governments will have the same base

What this leaves is that a set of site wide templates that can be
customized on a per object basis is required. CompoundDoc keeps it
templates site wide however the instance of the template is tied to that
object so it can be customized on a per object basis. The template is
merely the starting point.
> Anyway, it seems you have something nice working, and I hope I'll be able to
> help in the future.
> Philippe
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